Paul Barsky

Paul Barsky was the morning man at Z-95 (WLS-FM, 94.7) in Chicago in the mid-to-late 1980s. Before and after his time in Chicago he was a very successful morning man in Philadelphia.








Rick: I ask my readers to give me suggestions for people they'd like me to interview, and your name keeps coming up. Considering you haven't been on the air in Chicago for more than twenty years, and you were only here for a short time, you really made a name for yourself in Chicago. What was it about your show that you think people still remember it so fondly today?

Barsky: I really don't know. All I know is that when I first arrived in Chicago, I felt an instant connection. The same thing happened to me when I started in Philly where I spent the majority of my career before and after Chicago. Sometimes personalities click with markets, and sometimes they don't. I got lucky with both Chicago and Philly. The psychology behind why certain personalities have a lasting effect vs. others has always been up for debate. To try to answer your question, I guess I can safely say that I worked hard on the show every day to try to bring something new and entertaining to the listener. Even though off air I was very serious about the show, on air I never really took myself too seriously and had kind of a self deprecating sense of humor. Maybe listeners related to that and thought of me as one of them, I don't know.

In the beginning we were an ensemble cast, myself and three others, and we created some original produced bits that for some reason stuck with people over the years. I also started doing prank calls (called Phone scams) which many shows do today, but back then nobody was doing them on a regular basis so that material might have helped the show to stand out as well. We had a lot of strong benchmark bits which was important to have on a CHR station during that time period. So I think those elements made an impact. And yes, I too still hear from people today on Facebook, who still have tapes of the show etc., and it just blows me away....

Rick: When you first arrived in town you stepped right into a hornet's nest. WLS-FM had been simulcasting Larry Lujack's morning show, but he had decided to move to afternoons, which ticked off Steve and Garry, and the battle between Lujack and Dahl almost came to fisticuffs on the air. A week or so after that blow up, you arrived to take over the morning show. What was it was like to walk into that situation?

Barsky: It's funny you mention the Dahl and Lujack incident. At the time, Larry was still doing mornings and I guess he was still in his office and heard S&G ripping him on air, when he walked in to confront them. It wasn't "reality show" scripted schtick. Lujack was apparently a bit miffed. I think Uncle Lar was getting ready to lay an old school "Clint Eastwood" style beating on the boys. I remember sitting in my hotel room where the company put me up, and I was listening to the station and heard the Luajck/ Dahl blow up live and remembered thinking to myself "Well, working here should be fun."

It was a trip to be in the building at that time, because it was kind of like a soap opera. Both Steve and Larry were superstars in the market and their "in office battle" made for some real compelling radio. And here I was this kid from Philly walking into a dysfunctional radio atmosphere wondering how I was going to make a name for myself and stand out.

Rick: Refresh my memory--is that when it was changed to Z-95?

Barsky: Actually when I started it was still WLS-FM and not Z-95 yet. When ABC decided to discontinue the Lujack morning simulcast,they had someone fill in on the interim basis just playing music, but they knew they needed a show. That's when they decided to hire me for WLS-FM . So Lujack was still on mornings at WLS-AM when I started on the FM side.When he eventually moved to afternoons was around the time we were re branded as Z-95.

Rick: What are some of your favorite memories from your time in Chicago?

Barsky: There are so many, it's hard to pick one. Being an east coast guy, when I first arrived in Chicago, I guess I kind of expected it to be like New York. But it's got a completely different feel and energy. I fell in love with Chicago immediately, especially the people. There's just something special about that Midwestern thing. Down to earth people, but with a somewhat dry, and irreverent sense of humor. Even to this day, when I think of the quintessential Chicago dude, I think Bill Murray. And for women, Bonnie Hunt. I was a former baseball player in my youth, so I know it sounds cliche, but the first time walking into Wrigley Field for me was almost spiritual.

One memory that will always stick out in my mind is my first week at WLS-FM. The station at the time was on Michigan Ave. and I lived on East Ohio street. Since I wasn't that far from the station , I figured there was no sense in having a car and that I'd just jump into a cab at 4:00am. So it's early December and this particular morning , there's no cab outside my building. I waited and waited. Nothing. It was snowing hard and nobody was on the road. Not a single car. So I realize that I need to hoof it. Now mind you, I had just arrived from Philly and had no idea about the Chicago winter so all I had was a leather jacket. And I'm thinking to myself " I'm from the east coast, I went to college in upstate NY , I can handle this , no problem".

Long story short, when I finally arrived to the station after my 20 minute "little trek" down Michigan Ave. which included my first meeting with the sub zero biting wind coming off the Chicago River, I literally had no feeling in my face or hands. My ears were purple.My moustache was completely frozen, I think part of it actually broke off. Turns out it was 25 below with the wind chill. I didn't thaw out till about 7am. I had never felt cold like that in my life. Welcome to Chicago, Philly boy!

Rick: That Z-95 format was a direct competitor of B-96--it was a very uptempo hot hits format. What did you think of the music you played on that show?

Barsky: Well in the beginning, it was your typical straight ahead CHR station musically. Although about a year in, we started to skew in more of a rock leaning CHR direction vs. B-96 which leaned more Rhythmic. As far as my show, we played less and less music as the show gained more traction in popularity. It personally never really mattered what I played on the air, as my concern was more about what I was doing in between the songs.

Rick: Your ratings were pretty solid in retrospect. What happened at Z-95 to force you out?

Barsky: The reason for my departure was a strange one and still kind of a mystery. I've actually heard two separate stories over the years. Here's the first: I was originally signed to a four year deal. When I was hired, the morning show was around 21st place 12+. It took a couple of years to see some results, but eventually we started to see some steady growth. Then halfway into my final year,something popped and the show was really took off and the ratings really shot up as well.

My deal was almost up and I was making pretty good money. According to my agent at the time, his feeling was that ABC knew that we would be coming in for a new deal at much bigger numbers and they felt like they could get another show for much less than they would have to pay me. So they let me go, and (this always happens in radio) that same week the ratings come out and I get the highest numbers ever for the station in the morning, and the rest of the station jumped up as well beating our main competitor B-96.

The second story was that there was someone high up in the company who felt that what I was doing on my show on a CHR station was a bit too edgy for a conservative company like Cap Cities. Bottom line is that there may be some truth to both stories, and in the end they hired a super "family friendly" show to replace me. Unfortunately within a year their new show didn't catch on and went from the top 5, where I left it, back down to 20th. Since mornings was the cornerstone of the station, it really effected the overall station's ratings. That's when the house of cards collapsed and that's when all the stunts like "Hell 947 " etc. took place. Unfortunately for the company,the 94.7 frequency for many, many years never recovered, until a few years back when it put on the current Oldies format.

Rick: A lot of people may not remember this, but one of the newsmen on your show was Wayne Messmer. Wayne is now known as one of the quintessential National Anthem singers in Chicago. Was he already singing in those days?

Barsky: Yes, Wayne had always been a singer and was the PA announcer and National Anthem singer for the Cubs while he was doing the show with me. Listeners would often call the show and ask Wayne to sing the anthem. It got to be funny because we'd be in the middle of something and I'd take an unscreened call at random and there would be the request. And Wayne would sing it every time.It completely stopped the show in it's tracks. And then we'd go back to what we were talking about as if nothing ever happened. In addition to that, since I was able to carry a tune as well, but not even close to Wayne's talent, we'd occasionally take listener song requests on air and instead of playing the songs, we'd sing them with reverb and it became pretty popular bit. What made it fun was that most of the time we wouldn't know the words or melody so we made up our own. Trainwreck radio at it's best.

Wayne was one of those guys who I don't believe ever knew how funny he really was. He once told me a story while I was driving that was so funny I literally had to pull the car off of the expressway from laughing so hard because I couldn't see through my tears. It was the type of laughter where no sound came out because you're gasping for air. That's the only time something like that ever happened to me .Great talent and great guy. The last couple of years of the show it was just Wayne and myself and that's when I think the show sounded the best.

We were also joined by a few different producers who we added to the mix on air. Speaking of "Mix," our last producer was Eric Ferguson who was just beginning his career, and who's been at the top in the market with the "Eric and Kathy Show" for many years now. I'm thrilled for Eric's success. It's always fantastic to see good things happen for good people in this biz.

Rick: You were one of the pioneers of the morning zoo format, at least here in Chicago. I think it's safe to say that your show was the first one in Chicago to use that approach--your show was even called "Barsky's Morning Zoo."

Barsky: My show previously in Philly wasn't the Morning Zoo. It was always the "Barsky Show." John DeBella who was at the legendary Rock station WMMR in Philly in the 80's had the Morning Zoo. The real pioneers of the concept were Scott Shannon and Cleveland Wheeler back in the late 70's in Tampa. The term "Morning Zoo" in the 80's was not so much a set formula or concept, but rather more of a positioning and branding statement for ensemble cast morning shows. Not much different than "Breakfast Club", "Madhouse", "Playhouse" etc.

So here's how my show was renamed the Barsky Morning Zoo. I was hired at WLS-FM by Jan Jeffries (Photo) who was the PD at the time. We were WLS-FM for a short while, and the idea was to drop the WLS-FM moniker because since they were no longer simulcasting Lujack in the morning, they didn't see the need to create any more confusion between WLS-AM and FM. B-96 was our head on competitor, so our station decided to counter with Z-95.

Jan felt that since we were Z-95, the term "ZOO" in the morning would help and enhance the new "Z" moniker. So I was told that it would be called the "Barsky Morning Zoo" from that point on. You have to remember at that time, ensemble morning shows were doing well in other major markets and many of them used the ZOO moniker and branding. Chicago never had that brand in the market, so the station saw the opportunity to grab it and put it in place before any of our competitors. Eventually the name changed back to "The Barsky Show" on Z-95, and we ditched the morning zoo name.

Rick: Do you think the morning zoo format is dead?

Barsky: I think there are a few heritage morning shows in radio who still use the term, like Z100 in NY because it's still very successful. But having said that, the term is kind of outdated and is in many cases part of our vernacular when it comes to what the average Joe uses to describe "those wacky DJ's in the morning." And usually not in such a very favorable light.

Rick: Most recently you were doing sports talk in Dallas. How did you like doing the sports talk format?

Barsky: It was challenging, at times fun and completely different than anything I've ever done in radio. Challenging because truth be told, I was not your typical sports talk guy. Not even close. At the most I was a casual sports fan. But I quickly learned that in sports talk radio "casual" wont cut it. You need to really know your stuff. You need to not only know about your hometown teams, but you need to know the ins and out of every team in every sport. Credibility with the sports talk listener is very important. If you're not on top of it, they'll smell blood and you're toast. So I had to take a crash course in Dallas sports just to catch up because I was on the air with guys who had been doing sports radio for 20 years.

The idea when I was hired was to team me up with a former ESPN sports analyst to bring some entertainment to the show. The station felt like they needed someone like me who was a "morning radio guy" to drive the show. So on paper, it made sense. And because of my versatility in a variety of formats and presentations like CHR, Alternative, Rock, Hot AC, Talk etc. I figured why not give it a go, it's just another format. Not true.

Sports radio is it's own entity and unlike any other radio genre. Most of the personalities in sports radio did not come up in the industry like I did as a music radio morning guy. They're for the most part not "radio people." Most of them are either sports writers, TV sports reporters, former jocks or super sports geeks who got a shot to be on the radio. It's a completely different mindset and approach with it's own nuances. So this experience was a whole new world for me, but ultimately not a good fit. And for the first time in my radio career, I was completely out of my comfort zone which wasn't necessarily a bad thing. I think it's important to challenge and push yourself on occasion. I believe it makes you stronger in every way. You live, learn, and move forward.

Rick: What's next for you? Is there any chance you may re-emerge on the Chicago airwaves?

Barsky: I've only been off the air for a few months and I'm looking at some possibilities to be back on air fairly soon. I'm still extremely passionate about entertaining, but right now for me it's about finding the right fit. I've also been exploring radio station ownership off and on over the years, and I'm currently looking into an opportunity as we speak. But I've learned that it's a process that is often long and tedious to say the least. In fact the last time I did this was right after I left Chicago a little more than 20 years ago, I was part of a group that came very close to purchasing a Boston radio station.

As far as doing another radio show in Chicago, it's something I always thought about because of my love for the city, but for whatever reason the right opportunity never presented itself. So a return to Chicago? In this business I've learned you can never say never.

Rick: Thanks for taking the time to do this.

Barsky: Thanks Rick, I enjoyed the interview and reminiscing about my days in Chicago. It was a part of my career and life that I'll always treasure. And the fact that people still remember my show after all these years is quite humbling to say the least....

David Kaplan

David Kaplan hosts "Chicago Sports Night" weeknights on WGN Radio (AM 720). He also hosts "Chicago Tribune Live" every night on Comcast SportsNet.




Rick: You’ve had a pretty crazy last couple of months over at WGN. Has all the dust settled? Are you back in the groove again?


Kap: Yeah, absolutely back to normal. The guy I give the most credit to for keeping the ship afloat is Tom Langmyer (photo), the GM of WGN. I have no complaints at all with him. He’s been 100% honest with me throughout all of this, totally straight up. Even when things didn’t look so good for me he said “Hang in there it’s gonna work out.” And things really are back to normal. I’m feeling good again about our direction.

Rick: I’ve always been a fan of Brian Noonan (who has been co-hosting the show). I thought he was languishing on those weekend overnight shifts. And he obviously has a pretty good handle on sports. How do you two get along?

Kap: Amazingly well. The funny thing is, I had never worked with him—I had really only met him in the building, that was it. When Tom decided to bring me back, I asked him if he wanted me to do the show by myself or with someone, and he said he’d really like to have a second voice in there, and thought that Brian Noonan and I would have a great chemistry. And he was right.

Rick: How would you compare him to your former co-host Tom Waddle?

Kap: Totally different. Brian (Photo) is one of the funniest humans you’ll ever hear. He has a background in stand up comedy, and he’s razor sharp, he’s got a very quick wit. Tommy was witty and funny too, but he was also a professional athlete, so he came at from it a totally different perspective.

Rick: Do you keep in touch with Waddle now that he’s over at ESPN?

Kap: All the time. I just talked to him yesterday. I worked so long with Tommy, I consider him the best friend in the world. We did ten years together. It was the longest running sports talk show in Chicago radio history.

Rick: Do you prefer doing the show with a partner, or by yourself, because you’ve done it both ways now.

Kap: I got comfortable doing it myself too, but I enjoy having a partner; someone to laugh with, someone to pitch in, someone to help carry the show. It’s really difficult carrying a show all by yourself. Three hours is a lot of time to fill.

Rick: A new PD (Bill White) started this week. Have you met with him yet, and what are your impressions of him?

Kap: Haven’t met with him yet, and I probably won’t really get a chance to sit down with him for a little while. I’m heading down to spring training next week, but we’ve exchanged e-mails, and I’ve heard nothing but great things about the guy.

Rick: Now that the Michaels/Metheney era is finally 100% in the rear-view mirror, what are your thoughts about that tumultuous couple of years?

Kap: This is the way I look at it. People that aren’t from here, simply don’t understand Chicago. We’re a very provincial town. That’s not to say that you can’t learn about Chicago, but if you’re an outsider, you need to spend some time learning the city rather than just coming in here thinking that you can do a cookie-cutter version of something that works somewhere else. That’s especially unforgivable when you’re dealing with an institution like WGN. This radio station and this city are unlike any other. They didn’t understand that.

Rick: This is just my opinion, but I couldn’t believe they thought it was a good idea to eliminate sports from a station that carried the Cubs and the Blackhawks...

Kap: And Northewestern! Yes, it was mindboggling for sure. Tom Langmyer gets it. He’s a sports guy and came from a sports background, and though he has never said this to me, I’m sure these past few years were difficult for him.

Rick: Even when you weren’t doing WGN Sports Night on WGN, you were doing the nightly show on Comcast. As a multi-media star, give me the pros and cons of television versus radio.

Kap: And a newspaper column too.

Rick: That's right, "Around Town" with Fred Mitchell. So you work in three different media.

Kap: I love ‘em all. Comcast is awesome. Jim Corno Sr. is amazing to work for—he really runs a first class organization. He’s so approachable and so accepting. The whole staff over there is outstanding. As for comparing radio and TV, they are a bit different.

In radio you never know where the conversation is headed, because someone can call in, and the show will go in a whole different direction than you thought. In TV we plan it out a lot more. We have a noon meeting every day and throw everything against the wall, discussing what we’ll do any given night. It’s still free-flowing on our particular show, but it’s a little more structured than doing a radio show.

As for writing, I’ve been doing that for a long time, even before I did either radio or television. The "Around Town" column with Fred Mitchell gives me a chance to work with an absolute pro. Plus, it gives us a chance to call attention to worthwhile causes, the benefits the athletes and coaches do, and there’s an opportunity to break stories too. We broke the Marmol extension weeks ago, but it didn’t officially come out until this week.

Rick: I was still working at the Loop FM when you first started on WMVP years ago—and I don’t think people even realize this about you anymore because you do every sport so well—but you were a basketball guy, first and foremost.

Kap: I was an Asst. coach at NIU from 1982 to 1986, and I was a scout for the Indiana Pacers and Seattle Supersonics after that. John McDougal (the NIU coach) was like a second father to me—he took a chance on this unknown 21 year old kid with one year of high school coaching. I really cherish my time there. The relationships that I formed in basketball are still important relationships to this day. (USC Coach) Kevin O’Neil is one of my closest friends. We’ve gone through divorces and weddings and the death of a parent together. I walked down the aisle at his wedding with (MSU coach) Tom Izzo. There was a time back in the 80s, when we were all working our way up, and Kevin was the only one that could afford a hotel room. So one night, four of us all stayed in his room—Tom Izzo, (Indiana coach) Tom Crean, and me. These guys were friends before they were famous, and they have been very loyal to me. Tom Izzo called in on the radio show the night before his first national championship game.

Here's another great Tom Izzo story. The first time I got to do a major basketball game on national television (years ago), it was Loyola vs. MSU. Tom was so great to me. He said “This is confidential, but it will help you. Here’s the scouting report, here’s the plays we call, and the plays they call.” Right before the game started, he came up to the scorer’s table and said: “Tell everyone on the broadcast that you’ve been watching 8 hours of tape, and if MSU wins the tip they’re going to run a quick hitter to get Charlie Bell a triple.”

So, on the air, my partner said “Any final thoughts?”

I said just what Izzo said I should say, and boom it happened. Izzo, who is about the most intense guy you’ll ever see during a game, looked over at me and winked.

All of these guys I met during my basketball years still give me tips and scoops. I always tell kids that networking is the key to the whole world. If you’re good networker, you’re bound to do well. That’s just a fact.

Rick: You’re also obviously a major Cubs fan. That’s one thing I love about listening to your show. You feel our pain. How big of a thrill is it for a life-long Cubs fan to have such an important role on the Cubs flagship radio station?

Kap: It’s an amazing honor, although if you know about my history it is a little ironic. My brother (who is now an eye surgeon) and I were vendors at both ballparks to make a little extra money. We sold a shirt after the 1983 Sox season that said “So close we can taste it” with a bite out of the baseball. Well, in 1985 the Cubs were coming off their big year, so we figured to sell a version of the “So close we can taste it shirt” for their fans too. If you remember that year, the Cubs were in first place in June, so we had these shirts made up, and sold ‘em outside Wrigley before the game. One day some guy bought ten of them, but I only had nine in my bag. I said “I’ll go get the other one out of my car and bring it to your seat. What’s your seat number?”

So I did. He was sitting right behind the bullpen. But when I tossed the shirt to him, he thought he was doing me a big favor by holding it up for everyone to see. Unfortunately, one person that saw it was Dallas Green (photo), who was watching from the box. He found me and had me fired as a vendor for copyright infringement. A friend of mine wrote a letter to him on my behalf, but they wouldn’t take me back. A week or two after I was fired, the five starting pitchers all went on the DL, and the Cubs fell apart. So, yeah, it is an honor to be working on the Cubs flagship, but it’s a little ironic too.

Rick: You’ve interviewed just about every Chicago athlete over the past few decades. Do you have any favorites?

Kap: Michael Jordan was the best. Obviously he’s probably the greatest athlete of all time, but he was also great to me. I got to play golf with him, and that was an amazing experience. The most impressive thing about him was the way he handled the press. The first reporter would ask a question, and he would answer it respectfully, but then some kid from a school newspaper or someone that wasn’t in the room would come in and ask the same question—and sometimes it was a ridiculous question, but he would just smile and calmly answer it again. I never saw him snap at anyone. In that regard, he was a terrific role model.

Another memorable interview wasn’t technically sports-related, although I guess you could say it was. Two weeks after the OJ trial, I got an exclusive one-hour interview with Johnny Cochran. The only rule was that there were no restrictions on the interview. We sat in the showcase studio, and man, was I ready for that interview. My late father was an attorney, and he helped me prep. I had these questions on a legal pad and just started firing, and Cochran looked at me during our first break and said: “Who prepped you for this?”

Another one that I’ll never forget is Bobby Knight. I got to know him a little bit and one day we had dinner. It was a mind blowing experience—he’s the kind of person that is just a life force—he takes over a room. When he got fired at Indiana, I called him that night, and left a voicemail asking for an interview. You remember how crazy that story was? Well, the next night he did the exclusive interview with Jeremy Schaap at ESPN, but the following day he called my office and said “What are you doing on Wednesday?” I said “Nothing.” He said “Come and see me.”

So, on Wednesday, I pulled into his driveway as Bob Verdi was pulling out, and I spent the next five hours in his family room. He pulled out his contract and showed it to me. There was a clause that basically said that anything related to the basketball operations was the sole domain of Coach Knight, and since he was fired for violating the chain of command, he said to me: “Sounds like I don’t have a boss, so how could I have violated the chain of command?”

I got enough tape from him to do a full hour show. I was getting calls from all over the country asking me how I managed to secure this exclusive interview, and I wondered too. I asked him point blank, and he said: “Because I trust you, and I know you won’t screw me.” A few years later he came to town with Texas Tech, and I asked him to do the TV show (I was free-lancing at Channel 5 at the time), and he came right in.

Those are probably the three that come to mind first.

Rick: Finally, I like to ask native Chicagoans this question, just because it’s fun to see what influenced you as a broadcaster. You’re a Niles East grad, and a Chicago guy through and through, and I know you’re a real student of Chicago radio history. Who did you listen to when you were growing up?

Kap: For me, the number one guy, bar none, was Harry. Harry Caray was the voice of the fan. I remember listening to Harry, even when he was with the White Sox. (My brother was a Sox fan.) I loved the honesty. I was enthralled. I also loved Jack Brickhouse—he was a Chicago institution. But as for non-sports, the show I never missed was Steve and Garry. When I was out recruiting I had that show on in the car every single day. I loved it. Those guys were geniuses.

Rick: And now you follow Garry Meier every night.

Kap: And I’m still a big fan. I think he has been a great addition to the station.

Leslie Harris

Leslie Harris is the evening personality at 95.9 FM, "The River"



RADIO-OGRAPHY

US99 '82-'86
WCKG '86-'88
WLS-AM '88-'89
WFYR '89-'91
The Blaze '91-'93
Y108 '93
Rock 103-5 '94-'97
CD 94.7 '98
The River '07-present

Rick: For those that aren't in the western burbs, or haven't tuned it in yet, how would you describe the format of The River?

Leslie: We have two main focuses. The first is that we are hyper-local. We're in the western suburbs, and we focus on this area. We're very community oriented, and we are out in the community, usually at least once or twice a week. No other station serves the western suburbs the way we do. As far as the music goes, the last couple of years we've been a classic-hits station, with an emphasis on 'hits.' With recent changes, we've added a lot more music, as well as some deeper cuts.

Rick: You've been at the River now for a few years, but there have been a few significant changes in the past month or two; you got a new PD and a new time-slot. How are you adjusting to the new time slot?

Leslie: When I was on middays, I knew that there were a lot of moms and kids listening, so I felt I had to be 'nice.' I like that I can now let a different side of my personality show through. (some might say the smart-alecky side) I also like to rock, and we rock a little harder at night. And I've always been a night-owl. I'm still getting up to get my daughter off to school, but now I can go back to bed for a couple of hours, so I'm actually getting more sleep!

Rick: I worked with (new River PD) Zander briefly at the Loop, and you've also worked at several stations he worked at in the past. Have your paths crossed before this?

Leslie: Yeah, Zander (photo) and I worked together at Rock 103-5. We were both part-timers, so it was kinda weird when he became my new boss. Fortunately, we've always gotten along well.

Rick: You were a Chicago radio mainstay for most of the 80s and 90s, but you took a nearly ten year sabbatical to be a mom. Did you miss the business during that time?

Leslie: Initially, it was a relief to be able to just focus on the job of raising my kids. After awhile though, I definitely had those pangs of longing to be back on the air, but I also thought I had hung up my headphones for the last time. I figured I'd have to go back to weekends at least to start with, and I had no desire to give up that time with my family. It never even dawned on me to pursue something in suburban radio, until Scott Childers, who was at The River at the time, asked me if I'd be interested in coming to do some work there. (Scott now works for our sister station, Star 96.7 in Joliet)

Rick: Just looking over your radio resume, I can tell right away that you've witnessed a few pretty historic moments first hand. You were there for the final chapter of WLS-AM as a music station (in 1989). Describe what that was like.

Leslie: I sent them my resume on a lark. I couldn't believe I actually got hired to work at WLS. It was pretty amazing to work with so many legends - Fred Winston, John Landecker (photo), Catherine Johns, Jim Johnson, Jeff Hendrix, Les Grobstein - I could go on and on. And it was a trip to have regular listeners who would check in from Texas, Minnesota and Canada. But it was also a sad time. The music mix was awful. We played everything from Frank Sinatra and Tony Bennett to Motown to Gloria Estefan and Madonna. We all knew the end was near.

Rick: After WLS, you were also at the frequency 103.5. I'm not sure, but I think this must be a record. It was three different stations during your time there (WFYR, The Blaze, Rock 103.5). Which one was your favorite and why?

Leslie: That's an easy one - Rock 103-5. I loved the music. There had never been anything like it before. If it rocked, we played it. It was a great mix of classic rock artists, hair bands and alternative rock artists. We played the older stuff, as well as the new releases from established artists. We broke new artists. And we had attitude. It was really the first Active Rock station, and many other stations across the country modeled themselves after it. It was a fun and exciting place to work. It's also where I met Steven Tyler!

Rick: I remember listening to the Blaze the first day they were on the air. You were part of that original air staff. For a listener it was like radio whiplash going from FYR to the Blaze. What was it like from your side of the microphone?

Leslie: It was exciting and unnerving. I had a great PD at WFYR (Kurt Johnson) but I was so bored playing 'Love songs on 'FYR.' I would get really sleepy about an hour before going on the air! I was so happy that we were changing to a rock format, but a lot of people lost their jobs, including all of the full-timers from WFYR, except Brian Kelly who was let go as soon as his contract ran out. There was such a buzz on the street about it. People were hungry for that music, which hadn't had any other radio outlet. (I think people were getting their only 'fix' from MTV) When we changed formats, we played Rock! Rock! (til you drop) by Def Leppard for days on end. It was so absurd it became funny. I think I worked 3 shifts, so I listened to that song over and over for about 15 hours that weekend. Working at The Blaze was also a learning experience for me, as I'd never played a lot of that music before. I'm still playing a lot of it at The River.

Rick: You grew up in this area. Who were some of the radio personalities you listened to in your youth?

Leslie: I LOVED BOOGIE CHECK (ooh ah!) Really, everything Landecker did was great. Of course Larry Lujack and Fred Winston. I also loved Patti Haze (photo), who was one of the first great women rock jocks. And I've always admired Terri Hemmert's friendly, conversational style, and her enthusiasm for the music.

Rick: You've also worked with some radio legends (some of which you've already mentioned). Which ones were you most impressed with, and which ones influenced your own sound the most?

Leslie: I worked a lot of overnights at WLS, so I got to do a lot of cross-talk with Fred Winston who was doing mornings. I learned a lot about being myself on the air, but having fun while doing it, which of course makes it fun for the listeners. I also worked with Don Wade, both at US99 and at WLS. He had his show so carefully planned, yet made it sound completely conversational.

Rick: Finally, I know you're happy in the burbs, but is there any chance you'll ever make the move back to a downtown station in the future?

Leslie: I am happy at The River, but who knows? I absolutely love the city, and I may pursue something downtown someday. I hope there are still downtown radio jobs to pursue. As I mentioned earlier, one of the great things about The River and NextMedia's other stations is that we have a local focus. I hope the downtown stations get back to that, because I think that's what will save radio.

Mitch Rosen

Mitch Rosen is the program director of WSCR, The Score (670 AM)





Rick: You got your start in radio at WGN producing the overnight show by Eddie Schwartz. What did you learn about broadcasting from Eddie, and what did he mean to you personally?

Mitch: Eddie (photo) was flat out the best teacher I ever had in radio. He taught me how to chase a story, to be on top of the news of the day, how to track down guests, and the urgency radio is. No doubt he had his quirkiness, but he taught me radio in Chicago. He was an aggressive personality and at one time had a 20 share in overnight radio. I think the secret was that Eddie treated overnight like a prime time day part. I wrote him a note as a high school senior, then ended up interning at WGN, and then became a full-time producer. In a weird way, it was a radio dream come true.

Rick: You came to the Loop along with Eddie in the early 90s, and that was a strange marriage from the beginning. Now with the benefit of nearly twenty years of hindsight, do you think that move was a good one for Ed? When I interviewed Ed shortly before his death he still thought it was. He said: "It gave me a chance to re-energize myself in a new environment and to work with some great people." Do you agree with him?

Mitch: The Eddie move to the Loop was like the nerd in school that always got picked on by the cool kids suddenly being asked to join their group. At WGN, Eddie and I were kind of on an island. Don't get me wrong, it was a great station, but it was overnights, and we kind of got lost in the shuffle.

At that time the Loop was the coolest station in America, and I was thrilled that Eddie asked me to go along for the ride. The truth is I didn't know it was the Loop until the day before he announced he was going there. I really thought we were going to WLS. I never imagined for a second that The Loop was the next stop on The Eddie Tour. I can still remember his call to me when it was close to being official. (Now try to imagine this in Eddie's high pitched voice). He said: “Kid, were going to the LOOP!!” I said "Really?" He said it was going to be fun and all the big boy personalities were on board.

Larry Wert (photo) did something that I will never forget. He sent Eddie a box of hats; one for Brandmeier, Dahl and Meier, and Kevin Matthews, and a note that said throw your hat in the ring. Eddie never forgot that. We went in open minded about the personalities and their treatment of Eddie over the years, but the guys really treated him great. He felt cool. One of the funniest nights was the night that Kevin and Dahl sent a stripper to the studio to surprise big Ed. Ed quickly put on one of his 15 minutes jazz instrumentals.

The bottom line is that the other on-air stars welcomed us with open arms.

Rick: After producing Ed's show, you had another high-profile producing job--producing the morning show for Kevin Matthews--a man that lampooned Eddie more than anyone. I know Kevin pretty well, and I like him a lot, but I can't even imagine what it would be like producing his show. A producer needs to get inside the host's head, and with all those voices inside there, that would be extremely difficult. How did you do it?

Mitch: Most people say that Kevin is one of the most talented people in radio, and after working closely with him I totally agree. He was smart and always thought about the radio show. It was a 24 hour job for him. Kevin would call me at all times of the day and night. The phone would ring and I'd hear: “Hey bud, I have an idea..Lets send Pugsley to Nashville to try and get kicked out of Graceland on Elvis’s birthday." Sure enough, the next week Pugs was in Nashville. Kevin was a thinker and a radio geek at the same time.

Rick: After working on Kevin's show, you transitioned into management. Describe how that came about.

Mitch: It was always my goal, so I worked toward that. I learned from two of the best, Larry Wert and Jimmy de Castro. They taught me how to work with talent, and more importantly, how you work talent. They also taught me you have to take care of talent. That’s an important part of the job. Over the years, I think I've accomplished that.

Rick: How would you describe your management style?

Mitch: Pretty simple, really. Honesty, integrity, smart radio sense, and try to keep all employees happy. Also, it's important to remember that you can always be fair, but sometimes you can’t always be even. By that I mean that what works for some employees might not work for others.

Rick: You're the program director at the Score right now, but you've also programmed the other sports station in town. Describe the differences between the two stations from your perspective.

Mitch: The best news is that the sports radio format in Chicago is huge. Between both sports stations in town there are well over 1.5 million listeners per week. That's really incredible if you think about it. Five years ago that was unheard of. Men especially love sports talk on the radio.

Chicago is a passionate town for their teams and that translate to the airwaves. Chicago also is a town that loves to talk Chicago sports, and that’s what gives the Score a huge advantage. Starting with Les Grobstein overnights, Mully and Hanley in AM drive, Dan McNeil and Matt Spiegel, Boers and Bernstein, and Laurence Holmes, plus a great bunch of guys like Jason Goff, Matt Abbatacola, Mark Grote, and Ben Finfer amongst others, I feel great about our line-up. The ratings show the audience does too.

As for who built this sports talk franchise, guys like Jeff Schwartz who along with Seth Mason, Ron Gleason, and Danny Lee were guys who helped pave the way for sports talk in Chicago and nationwide.

Rick:  The ratings have swung back and forth between the two sports stations over the years, but currently the Score has got a pretty commanding overall lead. What do you think is the secret to the Score's recent success?

Mitch: Again, we keep it local. We focus on Chicago sports talk, and we present it with intelligent hosts doing smart topics. We brand the station as Chicago’s Sports Radio, because that’s truly what we are.

Rick:  The White Sox seem to follow you from station to station--I know you were instrumental in bringing them aboard at the Score. How have you managed to establish such a close relationship with them, and what's the key to keeping the Sox happy?

Mitch: I do not know if they follow me, but I have had a nice business relationship with Jerry Reinsdorf going back 20 years. I think there is a trust and always a feel of a partnership between us. The Sox are a great asset to this station. (Photo: Mitch, Jerry Reinsdorf, and Paul Agasse).

Rick:  Do your air personalities have to be careful about what they say about the Sox, or does anything go?

Mitch: We only have one rule. You can give your opinion, give your thoughts, give your passion, but do not get personal. So far so good.

Rick:  A manager has got to be able to handle the talent, and you've had some real challenges over the years in sports talk. Which of the sports talkers you've worked with were the easiest to deal with, and which were the most difficult?

Mitch: All personalities are different in their individual ways. All have great talent and passion or they would not be on the air in Chicago. One of the shows I’m most of proud of is how Mike Mulligan and Brian Hanley have made the transition from writers to radio personalities. The ratings in AM Drive have never been higher here at the Score. The competition in AM drive is fierce and these guys along with a great EP, Dustin Rhoades have been tremendous.

Next, I feel Danny Mac (photo) has grown professionally and personally since he was here last, and he and Matt have been outstanding in mid-days. Boers and Bernstein the longest running sports talk show in Chicago continue to blow the ratings up in a huge way, and Laurence Holmes is one of the smartest people on the air in Chicago.

I could not be more proud of our starting line-up.

Patty Martin

Patty Martin is the program director of WDRV (97.1 FM), The Drive.




RADIO-OGRAPHY

Started in college—WRSE, Elmhurst College (did it all-airshifts, PD, MD, Union Board rep, etc)

WXRT: 2 internships, first for Terri Hemmert (public affairs), then for Norm and Bob Gelms in programming (yep, Norm still hired me as MD after knowing me in my college days)

Q101: first paying gig…music research (Thanks to Hemmert for recommending me for the gig)

The Fox, WJKL, Elgin. First post-college on-air gig…nights. The station flipped to big band and I stayed doing 4p-10p. (Again, thanks to Hemmert for the recommendation)

WDEK: started out part time when it was still a cool eclectic rock station, and here’s where it gets interesting. I worked on 4 stations at 1 time. Weekdays I did WJKL + news on its AM (WRMN) then went to DEK to do overnights. Worked both stations Saturdays, slept on the couch at ‘DEK to sign on the “god squad” religious programming on their AM, WLBK Sundays at 7a. I was on-air somewhere 7 days a week, and any hour of the day, putting 700 miles a week on my car. After the “dues paying” initiation, I got full time nights and Asst Promotion Director at DEK. DEK flipped to Top 40 and I got dumped on overnights. My airshift was 7 hours, so I talked them into letting me play an album side at 3am so I could get some of my production done!

KMBY- Monterey- middays, pm drive, nights, morning news and Promotion Director and Music Director (not all at once)
KWAV-Monterey-daytime fill-in
KSJO-San Jose-nights and Music Director
KLOL-Houston-Music Director and weekends
WXRT-Music Director
WDRV-Program Director



Rick: You've been the program director at the Drive now for almost ten years. Take me back to that first phone call from Greg Solk. How did he convince you to come over from WXRT?

Patty: I’d known Greg for years, and every time he saw me he’d tell me he was going to hire me someday. Even back when I was living in CA and TX. I always figured he was blowing smoke! I think it was November ’00 that Greg called. The conversation went something like: How’re they treating you over there?. “Fine.” So you’re not interested in another opportunity then. “I might be…” (it was Bonneville after all, the best radio company to work for.) Greg said they had something in the works, he couldn’t give me any info about it but formatically it was right up my alley. After several meetings, he still wouldn’t clue me in and I just couldn’t make the leap without at least knowing the format. (I believe in trust, but I still lock my doors)

After the stunting, the Drive started the regular format with no jocks, and after hearing an hour of it, I called Greg and told him if he hadn’t found someone yet I was in. Fortunately for me, he hadn’t and I started a couple weeks later, in time for the launch with Bob Stroud

Rick: How has the station evolved musically since you arrived?

Patty: The Drive is an organic living breathing organism that evolves pretty constantly. When we launched, we needed to stand out. So we did that with a whisper (the IDs and much of the imaging was done with Nick Michaels whispering “The Drive”). We were very laid back and sounded very different than anything else on the dial. Plus, there was no one playing the bulk of the music we played.

As time has gone on, we’ve continually freshened our imaging, music and our approach. Successful companies need to evolve in order to thrive. Overall we sound much different than we did at the start, but it’s been a gradual process. These days, many other stations play a chunk of our music, but no one has the intangibles we have between the records. We maintain a deep respect for the music and the listeners in a way the others can’t touch.

Rick: When you look back on your decade of the Drive, what do you consider the highlights of that time?

Patty: Our run has been so amazingly consistent, it’s basically all a highlight! Some of the big feel-goods revolve around listener feedback. Be it in person at an event like the Drive Birthday concerts or via email, they have such genuine passion for what we do! Two others are ratings related…the initial response to the station and when PPM started. We got to see just how many people were actually tuning in. It’s quite a thrill, and quite humbling. When you realize so many people are connecting to what you do on a daily basis it makes you feel even more obligated to do your best for them.

Over the years we’ve developed a very special relationship with our listeners, especially through Drive Advisory Board. They’ve given us great ideas we’ve implemented on-air, and we thank them regularly with unexpected tokens of our appreciation…including a free birthday concert almost every year. It’s such fun to give out every ticket to Rosemont Theatre and see the diverse and passionate audience that embraces this music with us at our birthday celebrations.

Rick: You are blessed with a tremendous air-staff there. There probably isn't anyone on the staff that doesn't have at least twenty five years of radio experience. I'm guessing they don't require a ton of direction.

Patty: So true. It’s an amazingly gifted team, and I look at my role more as a coach. A great team is full of outstanding individual players, but championships aren’t won without coaching to bring that together. There’s always room for growth. The best are the best because they don’t stop trying to improve. Michael Jordan threw hundreds of pre-game free-throws. Players review game video. Our staff is expected to keep focused and give their all every break every day.

The triumvirate of Steve Downes, Bob Stroud (photo) and Bobby Skafish are the core. They have long histories of success, and they want that success to continue, which takes work. No one is allowed to phone it in at the Drive, even though just doing that they’d be better than most of the talent in town! Besides being an outstanding journalist, Kathy Voltmer has as strong a work ethic of any air talent I’ve encountered. Phil Manicki, Greg Easterling and our weekend team of Carla Leonardo, Steve Seaver, Allie Ellison, Marc Vernon, Don Nelson and Jim Foster all have impressive pedigrees, and the high quality of the talent in every hour of every day is something we’re very proud of. We’re also proud that we’re live and local 24/7. There’s never a moment when there’s not a live human being behind the console.

I’d be remiss if I didn’t highlight the contributions of the staff behind the scenes. Full credit for the positive environment in the hallways goes to Jerry Schnacke. He’s now Market Manager, but was our GM for over half the Drive’s 10 years. He created an atmosphere where creativity thrives, and people enjoy coming to work. Drew Horowitz is responsible for giving us the room to develop and grow. We have the 2 most accomplished production wizards in Chicago, Tom Couch and Matt Bisbee, and the unsung hero is Paul Webber. He’s a secret weapon, and that’s all I’ll say about that!

Rick: I absolutely LOVED that history of rock and roll special you aired recently. I think I listened to six hours or more of it. To hear a locally produced and written special of that caliber was amazing. How did that come about? 

Patty:  It was a true group effort. The original idea came from Director of Creative Services, Tom Couch. We passed the overall idea to key airstaff members for thoughts on how it should be flushed out. Skafish came up with the winning idea, and we were off and running. We figured out the “chapters” then the music to include and it was off to production. Downes, Stroud and Skafish wrote their chapters, Tom and Matt Bisbee wrote the connecting pieces. Several months in the making…and we are so happy with how it came out. The audience response was off the charts. It's running again Saturday (1/29).

Rick: I know that working as a PD for Greg Solk is a challenge. He's very hands-on (he told me so himself when I interviewed last year), and in your case in particular, the Drive was his creation. How does your relationship with Greg work on a day-to-day basis? 

Patty: He’s a challenge, but he should be, and he challenges me in a good way. I’m very self-motivating, but he sets the bar very high, and it’s invigorating to work to meet it. Greg (photo) travels a lot, so weeks can go by where we don’t see each other. When he’s on the road I send an occasional update email (nowhere near often enough, if you ask him). If I really need him, he’s reachable (and Fina Rodriguez is key in finding him!) When he’s in Chicago he spends 2 days a week at the Drive. That’s when we joke about him meddling, and doesn’t he have a plane to catch? The Drive is absolutely his baby, and I feel so fortunate that he’s entrusted its daily care and feeding to me! He has a definite vision for its evolution, and is the one who comes up with most of our unique features. I honestly feel that every radio station he touches is better because of his input, so I’m grateful for the attention he gives to the Drive.

Rick: Of course, you also worked for a strong personality at WXRT; Norm Winer. How would you compare and contrast Norm and Greg? 

Patty: They both have an unparalleled passion for what they do. Both are unquestionably responsible for their stations vision. Both love sports analogies. Both have a tendency to nit-pick, but Norm gets the nod there! Greg is much better at time management…he’s never late for a meeting, Norm, not so much! (Greg does have Fina which gives him a distinct advantage, but even if Norm had a Fina, he’d still be late!) And Norm loves playing Christmas music…Greg, not so much!

Rick: WXRT is also a unique place. People that work there almost never leave. I've interviewed a few that have and they said Norm was quite upset with them (at least initially) when they left. How did he react when you told him you were leaving in 2001? 

Patty: Norm (photo) was extremely gracious with me, especially considering the circumstances... I told him I might be taking the job the day before he left on vacation. The deal wasn’t done yet, but it would happen while he was gone and I didn’t want him to return to that surprise. I told him he was going to have to trust me, or he couldn’t go on vacation…(and that he really needed a vacation).

We agreed to keep it quiet and I’d call him as soon as it was done (ask Norm where he was when I called!). Norm got back to town on a Friday which was my cue to go into Harvey Wells’ office to tell him I was taking the Drive job, and was giving my 2 weeks notice…Harvey (as expected) told me that today was my last day (which was good since I was starting at the Drive in 3 days), and off I went. Sorry Harvey…I’m not sure we ever clued you in on that! John Farneda was in on it early on…I needed to train him because there was no way I’d leave them high and dry. Sorry Norm…not sure we ever clued you in on that!

Rick: What are some of your favorite memories from your time at WXRT? 

Patty: Hands down: my private Buddy Guy concerts. My office was the “green room” for any visiting artist, so they’d use it to warm up. Every time he came in (which was often) Buddy would sit in a chair 5 feet away picking away on his guitar, regaling me with stories. People would naturally gather around my door, but Buddy would say this was my private concert and they could only come in if I said it was ok! Another funny time was when the roof caught fire the day Sting was coming in. The place stunk with smoke, so we ran around spraying Ozium and lighting scented candles. It was much better by the time he got there.

Rick: You're a Chicago girl (Elmhurst College, Immaculate Conception), so you're quite familiar with Chicago radio history. Who did you listen to when you were growing up? 

Patty: I was the kid, to quote the Ramones, “with the covers pulled up over my head, radio playing so no one can see it.” It was a Mitsubishi transistor, as I recall, with a painful little ear bud. Early on it was WLS and WCFL, then in 8th grade, after graduating to a clock radio with FM, I stumbled on XRT, and my life changed overnight. Literally, because at the time XRT came on at midnight. I also enjoyed Triad Radio, WSDM, WDAI (pre-disco), WDHF, The WMET/WLUP rock wars, The Fox (out of Elgin, where I later worked).

Rick: The big news this past week was the sale of the Drive to Hubbard Broadcasting. Do you anticipate any changes coming to the Drive after the sale is final? 

Patty: The principals of Bonneville are coming to Hubbard, and we anticipate a very smooth transition. If all goes well, it will hopefully close around mid-May! My big worry is I’ll be in New Orleans at Jazz Fest when that happens. I want to be here for the celebration.

Ron Riley

Ron Riley was a part of the legendary WLS lineup in the 1960s. He also worked in Milwaukee, Cleveland, St. Louis, and Baltimore, but considers his time at WLS the pinnacle of his radio career. He later worked in television for more than twenty years.






Rick: I read somewhere that you got your start in radio by winning a contest when you were in high school.

Ron: I was one of those extroverted high school kids in northeastern Illinois, and WKRS-Waukegan had a contest to get a high school reporter to do high school news. I won that contest, and got to do it once a week, which was a real kick.

After college I got a full-time job there, doing newscasts and playing polka. My heroes at the time were from WOKY in Milwaukee. They had these great guys on the air before WLS played music, and I tried to sound like them. Well, one day I was doing a polka show and reading birthdays on the air, and the engineer said there was a guy on the phone that wanted to offer me a job. I thought it was a joke, so I told him to take a number.

After the show, I called the guy, and it was Jerry Bartell from Bartell Broadcasting. They owned a bunch of stations, and he said he’d like me to come to work for WAPL at Appleton. Are you kidding? And that was my first real morning show/disc jockey job. They had different names for everyone on the air, and the sales manager had just come back from a fishing trip on Lake Riley and he gave me the name Smiley Riley. Appleton was OK, but the whole time I was there, I wanted to go to Milwaukee. I was so excited when they finally offered me a stint as the all-night guy there. They paid me $90, and I said “You’re On!”

Rick: In Chicago, you’re best remembered for your days at WLS. Talk a little bit about your arrival at WLS, and the double-duty you were pulling during that first early stint.

Ron: I was doing the all night show in Milwaukee, but I was in the Reserves and they called me up for active duty. I had to go into the Navy for two years. When I came back from the service I got a job at KXOK in St. Louis. It was a rock station, and those were the stations that were really going to town at the time. But shortly after I started there they got a new program director, and you can probably guess the rest of the story. I was fired in three months.

I went to WJJD in Chicago on a part time basis—they were doing country music at the time. I knew Gene Taylor at WLS (photo), and so I called him to ask about a job. He said he didn’t have anything for me: “Sorry, Ron. I’m all set.” I got a part time offer in Cleveland, but it wasn’t set to start for awhile, so I called Milwaukee, and they asked me if I could do a few weeks of afternoon drive, as a fill-in. “Afternoon drive? Really? Sure.” I was living in Lincolnshire at the time, so it was a no-brainer. I had no sooner set the phone down when Gene Taylor called again, and asked me to fill in on the all-night show on WLS.

I said, “I just agreed to work in Milwaukee!” He told me that I should really think about it—it could open doors for me, and I decided—he was right. So I did both jobs for awhile. I would drive up to Milwaukee, do the afternoon show, drive back to Lincolnshire, sleep a few hours, and then go downtown and do the overnight show on WLS. Luckily, that only lasted a few weeks.

So I went to Cleveland and was enjoying my time there with a great team, and suddenly the Biondi thing blew up. He got blown out for getting into a fight about the number of commercials on his show. Clark Weber called me to tell me about it, and said, “Call Taylor.” So I did. I called him a lot, but he never took my call, and he never called me back. I figured I was out of the running, until Clark called again to say that they had narrowed down the list to two people and I was one of them. I kept calling Taylor’s secretary to leave phone numbers wherever I went (remember this was long before cell phones), and she was getting annoyed, but she did take down the numbers.

I’ll never forget...I was in the barber shop getting my haircut, when the barber said: “You've got a phone call.” It was Gene Taylor. He said “Ron, how would you like to work here?” I was very emotional when I got that call. I can still feel that emotion today when I talk about it. I sat down in the barber’s chair and tears started rolling down my face. The barber asked me if my mother had died or something.

I knew this was my big break. I just had no idea how big of a break it was. None of us knew at the time what an impact we were going to have on people. At one point during my WLS time, I had two secretaries answering all of my mail, because that’s how much of it was coming in from all over the country. The station booked us to do these record hops all over the place. Biondi and Clark would fly to their record hops. I wouldn’t go further than Kokomo, but I still did a ton of them. It’s gratifying even today to see that we impacted so many people. One time a girl in Minnesota sent me six notebooks that were filled with notes about all of my shows, what I talked about, what records I played. It was unbelievable. (Photo: The WLS staff at the time, Ron is in the lower right hand corner)

Rick: You were there for a pretty exciting time in music history; the dawning of the British Invasion. You even got the chance to interview the Beatles.

Ron: That’s true. Art Roberts and I were more tuned into the younger demos at night, and we climbed onto every bandwagon that came along. The people that ran the station had the insight to leave us alone and let us do what we thought was right. We developed our own character within the format, but we were pretty free. If we saw a trend, we could jump on it, and they would back us. The Beatles came on the scene, and the station got the record company to back us, and we got to be the station at their concert at Comiskey Park. They took a silver dollar survey and drew long hair on us, and I became “Ringo Ron.”

Rick: What were the Beatles like?

Ron: They were young kids, and they weren’t real sophisticated yet. They were way over the top. Everything was a big joke to them. They were very distracted. Art Roberts and I did a phone interview with them. They were on the set of A Hard Days Night at the time. They just passed the phone around to each other. “Would you like to speak to John?” Then Paul, etc. We recorded it in the afternoon, and played it back on our respective shows.

Rick: Being a part of WLS in the 1960s, you probably had more than a few memorable brushes with rock and roll greatness. Can you recall any others?

Ron: The record guys were calling all the time, saying they’d bring this band or that band up to my show. I was told by my program director to do what I wanted as far as the interviews went, as long as I didn’t talk too much. I had the Hollies on all the time. I still talk to Graham Nash occasionally. I still talk to Chad from Chad and Jeremy. He lives in Idaho now. We had Herman’s Hermits on. The Hollies would even take calls from the kids. In my mind, we were just putting another dimension to the music by exposing their personalities. That really worked out neat. I remember one time I was talking to Graham Nash, and someone called to say “Mama Cass is here,” and Nash said “Oh god, she’s following me around the country. Hide me.” She arrived with a rose between her teeth. We talked for awhile, and she kept asking about Graham Nash, and I pretended like I had no idea where he was.

Rick: Chicago in the 1960s was the center of the universe for awhile. Hugh Heffner was living in the Playboy Mansion on the north side, making headlines around the world. In 1968, the Democratic Convention came to Chicago, and everybody remembers those police riots in Grant Park. And throughout it all, the soundtrack for the decade was the rock and roll played by WLS. What was it like to have a front row seat to that time?

Ron: You know, it’s funny, all of that was going on in Chicago, but I was really so dedicated to what we were doing and so into it, that I didn’t really look around and take note of what was going on around us. When the riots were going on, Chuck Buell said to me, “I’m going to go check it out,” and he went out there and a cop kicked him, so he came back in pretty fast. I said “What did you expect?”

I guess I never really thought about it. I know that sounds strange now, but it’s true.

Rick: When I talk to radio guys about you, the thing they always mention is the “feud” you had with Clark Weber. When I interviewed Clark a few years ago, I asked him about you, and he joked: “He lives in a radio announcers home for the lame.” You wrote a blurb for his book recently and took a shot at him. The feud continues. How did that all start?

Ron: I was the big Beatles supporter on the staff, and Clark took the other side of the Beatles argument. He was on the side of the other bands—Beatles competitors like the Dave Clark 5. I was called Ringo Ron, so he began to call me Ringworm Ron, just to rip me. (Photo: Clark and Ron in the studio)

I used to take calls from these kids, and had them take shots at Clark on tape, saying things like “Down with Weber,” and I’d intersperse this into the show. I’d pretend to call him at home at night, (it was pre-recorded), and when he answered I’d make a loud trumpet noise, and he’d get all mad, “Riley, don’t you know I have to get up early!”

It was all this silly stuff. I had this character Bruce Lovely, and at Halloween, Bruce would drop pumpkins on Weber. It was just good clean dumb fun. This was ’65 or so. I’ve done twenty-plus years of radio and twenty plus years of television, and this is something I still hear about. A woman came up to me in the supermarket in Maryland just recently and said “Down with Weber!” Isn’t that something?

Rick: While that feud with Clark wasn’t real, the competition between WLS and WCFL was real—and it was fierce. Describe if you can how you perceived that competition, and how you reacted to it.

Ron: I didn’t pay any attention to that. Ron Britain was opposite me, but I made it a point not to listen to the competition and I didn’t really want to hear what they were doing—At least that’s the way I looked at it.

Sure, we were envious that they had Orkin, and we’d hear from the kids about the great stuff that Orkin did, but we weren’t used to sharing the audience. The kids started switching back and forth between the stations, and that changed what it was like behind the scenes at WLS. The fear was that we would lose money to WCFL, and that’s why we brought in a new program director. We did the format change, and went to this fake Drake format, and that wasn’t us--that stifled us a bit. We weren’t quite as innovative anymore after that. I couldn’t change. I did try, but I didn’t like it. And eventually they found a reason to let me go.

Rick: A friend of mine collects radio station records—that is, the promotional records that radio stations used to release. One of them in his collection is a record that you and Clark Weber did for the soldiers in Vietnam. How did that come about?

Ron: We had no real game plan. My whole life was an ad lib, but that record really was ad-libbed. We used to get lots of requests from servicemen in Vietnam for airchecks of our station, and we were sending out all these reel-to-reel tapes. It was getting a little pricey, so Gene Taylor said to Clark and me—“Go in there and do a show, and we’ll press a record.” So we played some hit records, a few beer commercials, and tripped over each other trying to get in some one liners. Mostly we were just putting each other down, kidding around. Occasionally one of those records will show up on eBay. I think I still have one around my house somewhere.

Rick: Another one of the memorable things from your WLS time was your connection to the show “Batman.” That was huge at the time.

Ron: I used to give updates on the air to people listening on the radio. The PR department came up with this idea of the Batman club, and got a Batman suit from Hollywood, and we did a promo at Channel 7. We made up a fan club card, and got bumper stickers, and it was way bigger than any of us thought it would be. Someone sent me a picture of a tank in Vietnam with my bumper sticker on it. I remember when we started, Taylor asked me how many bumper stickers they needed to print up, and I guessed we’d need about 5000, but it ended up being about 100,000 or so.

I even got a cameo on the show. ABC set it up. It was the episode called “Ice Spy” and I flew out to Hollywood with my brother. I had a trailer and a costume and eight words in the script. I was playing an usher in an ice rink, and walked into the box Adam Ward was sitting, and I said, “Mr. Wayne you have a phone call.” I think it’s on YouTube. People send it to me occasionally.

Rick: After you left Chicago in 1971, you moved east, landing in Baltimore. You eventually had an entire second career as a television weather man. How did that come about?

Ron: I was a program director in Baltimore—we were one of the last AM Rockers there, and I could see the writing on the wall—it wasn’t going to last much longer. One day I got a call from the program director at Channel 11 in Baltimore. He said he was a fan of mine from back in the WLS days, and he was doing a local show called “Bowling for Dollars,” and he wondered if I would be willing to audition for it. I hadn’t really done any television other than a few guest spots, but I went to the audition, and I got the job. So for awhile I was doing both the program director job, and the “Bowling for Dollars” show. I did that for four or five years.

About that time Plough Incorporated, the owner of the station, brought in a consultant that knew less than we did, and I figured, that’s it. It’s time to move on before they move me on. They changed over to country, and I was very fortunate that Channel 13 called me. Another former WLS fan was running it, and he asked me if I would consider doing the weather. I had never done anything like that before, but I figured I’d give it a try. Spencer Christian was their weatherman, and I filled in for him. There wasn’t a huge learning curve at the time. We didn’t have all the computer graphics, we were using refrigerator magnets. (laughs). But I kept that up and kept working there, as a weekend and fill in guy.

Oprah worked at that station too. When she got the offer from Chicago she pulled me aside and said “Ron, you’re from Chicago. I got this offer to do a talk show there. Do you think I should take it? Is it a good move?” I was thinking to myself, oh boy, she’s going to get killed in Chicago, so I said “Everybody loves you here. You don’t want to go to Chicago.” Good thing she didn’t listen to me.

I went over to Channel 2 after that, and then I got a call from another former WLS fan, a guy in Washington. He hired me to work at Newschannel 8, an all-news cable station, and that’s when I got my first full time morning television show. I never did get my meteorology degree, but I did get a National Weather Service seal, and I did learn quite a bit about the weather. Although, in all honesty, I was more of a personality, and less of a “metereologist” per se. But I was there for 16 years. I just retired two years ago, and I now I do part-time radio work for WTOP, delivering weather forecasts to the all-news station. I get to work out of my house, which I love.

Rick: Do you ever make it back to Chicago any more? Do you keep in touch with any of your former colleagues?

Ron: Absolutely. I come to Chicago a couple of times a year. We have a lot of relations in town. I was back in August and had lunch with Bernie Allen and Clark Weber, and a couple of record guys, and it was great. I love Chicago.

Ron Santo

Sad, sad news. Ron Santo passed away at the age of 70. Full details are here.

He never got to see the Cubs win the World Series. He never made it into the Hall of Fame. And there haven't been many people in the world that more desperately wanted both. That's the first thing I thought of when I heard he died this morning. I'm sure most Cub fans thought the same thing. That, and it's not going to be the same listening to the Cubs on the radio without him.

I met Ron once about ten years ago and he was very nice to me, but I don't claim to know him at all. I did, however, talk to a few people the past few years that were among his closest friends.

*****

One of them was his broadcast partner Pat Hughes.

We discussed Ron...

Rick: Your chemistry with Ron Santo is really amazing—it’s like yin  and yang. He is pure emotion—and you are the voice of reason. I’m sure  that’s part of the secret to your chemistry, but there’s obviously more  to it than that. It seems like you also have real affection for each  other. Would that be fair to say?

Pat: Yes it would. We have amazing harmony, very few bad vibes.  Forget baseball, he’s just an extraordinary human being. I’ve never met  anyone like him. Beyond baseball, he’s an icon for diabetics everywhere.  What he’s been through! What he’s accomplished! Ron’s an inspiration.

Rick: Have the two of you ever had a fight?

Pat: (laughs) Hell no. Anytime you work together as long as we  have, you have a few minor little disagreements, but nothing bad. Never.

Rick: I used to love when you did the attendance game with him and  you beat him every day. Even for something like that—his emotions were  on his sleeve—he would get so upset. I know that’s what Cub fans love  about him. As much as it hurts us to lose, we can hear in his voice that  it hurts him even more. Do you ever worry that the strain of that is  having a detrimental effect on his health?

Pat:  I used to, but not anymore. The man is 70 years old. He’s had diabetes,  and cancer. He’s lost his bladder and his legs. He’s gone through  everything you can imagine. Why would you worry anymore? He’s like a  superman, a man of steel. Plus, I think it’s better for him to get it  out of his system, than to let it build up inside him.

*****

Todd Manley was the WGN production director for years, and he beautifully captured the spirit of the Pat & Ron broadcasts in his promos...
PAT AND RON PROMO--A Steamy Fan
PAT AND RON PROMO--The Marrying Type
PAT AND RON PROMO--Snot
PAT & RON PROMO--I Dream of Jeannie

******

I also interviewed Andy Masur, his former colleague at WGN, now the play by play man of the San Diego Padres...

Rick: The years you were at WGN were a roller coaster ride for Ron  Santo; from the lows of his health problems and the Hall of Fame snubs,  to the highs of the day his number was retired, and the Cubs 2003  playoff run. Was that time an emotional time for the rest of you in the  booth too?

Andy:  First off, I must say, that Ron Santo is one of my heroes. Not for his  play on the field, but for his work and passion off the field. He was a  great player, no doubt, but he’s an even better person. Ron is one of  the toughest human beings I have ever met. With all the physical  problems he’s encountered over the past 8 or so years, I never once  heard the man utter the words “why me?” Never. That’s a quality few  people have. I think about Ron every day.

As far as 2003 goes, I’m just now finding that I’m able to talk about  the year and how it started and finished. Ron’s Hall of Fame snub in  February of that year was devastating to all of us in the booth. He  really felt that it was his year. It didn’t happen. The Cubs played  remarkable baseball that season, and I’ll never forget after they  clinched the division with the double header sweep of the Pirates, how  many of the players I interviewed in the clubhouse, were saying “this is  for Ron”.

I remember the next day, when Ron’s number was retired, looking at the  sign on the fence behind the bleachers in left field “Ron Santo a  perfect 10” and thinking, this has to make him feel 100 feet tall. It  did. An honor well deserved.

The shame of it all though, was Ron didn’t get to enjoy the playoffs in  the booth. Another health scare kept him out, and all of us in the  booth, from Pat to Matt Boltz, were devastated that Ron wouldn’t be with  us. I’ll never forget Pat’s call at the end of the Braves series, “Ron  Santo this one’s for you!”, I still seriously get choked up just  thinking about it.

So to answer your original question, yes, it was a great year, but a very emotional year for all of us.

******

A few years ago the Associated Press did a story about Ron, and they interviewed me as part of the piece, to get a fan's perspective. Here's a portion of that article...

People around Santo have gone to him and suggested he "detach himself a little bit," said Bob Brenly, a former broadcast partner who is now an analyst for the team's television broadcasts. "But it's not in him," he said.

Even fans have taken notice.

"When he's not on the broadcast I'm actually worried about his health," said Rick Kaempfer, a lifelong fan who has a website (www.justonebadcentury.com) devoted to the Cubs.

Santo also has something that fans like Kaempfer value above everything else. Hope. No matter what happens, no matter how many years and how many ways the Cubs fail, Santo does not give up hope.

"I heard him talking about how the Rockies won 21 in a row a few years ago (at one stretch they won 21 of 22 games), hanging his hat on that, saying it could be us," Kaempfer said.

It is Santo's devotion to his team and his optimism that he will see the Cubs win a World Series title that helps explain the attachment that fans like Kaempfer have to Santo.

"It unifies Cub Fans," Kaempfer said.

******

What kind of a man was he to Cub fans? This story about meeting Ron in the summer of 1963 captures it about as well as any story I've ever heard...



******

As for me, I remember watching this game from the summer of 1970. The game he hit three home runs. Lou Boudreau and Vince Lloyd had the call.

That's the way I'm going to remember him.

Rest in Peace, Ron Santo. Cub nation already misses you. To be honest, I'm getting a little choked up just thinking about it.